One of the core beliefs of the Campbell River Vineyard is that God is speaking to us. There is a Rama Space in their church. People who receive a word, vision or relevant scripture reference can explain to the congregation what the Lord has put on their hearts. So Cortes Currents asked Senior Pastors Barry and Nancy Kaardal, ‘How does God speak to us?’
God speaks in multiple ways
“Well, actually God speaks to us in multiple ways,” replied Nancy.
“Sometimes we know that this is Him, because there’s such a strong presence in the room. It’s so quiet that you know it’s God. Sometimes you just think it’s your own voice talking. Each person is built different and each person hears the way God has made them to hear.”
She proceeded to list the ways God speaks to people:
- A verse that stands out when you are reading Scripture, that might even bring you to tears because it went so deep
- a dream, a picture that enters your mind, or a vision
- seemingly random thoughts
“Sometimes I will say things and I actually don’t know it is God’s speaking. I just say things to people and random stuff comes out of my mouth,” she explained.
“They say, ‘How did you know that?’”
“I said, ‘Well, I didn’t, but you confirming what I just said means that it’s God that has just spoken to you and this is a word from Him.’”
Is it God speaking?
Nancy said that when she gets ‘a word,’ she usually seeks confirmation from other believers.
Barry agreed, “Especially if it’s a directive word for the church or for a person’s life, we would counsel them to get the whole community helping to discern what God is actually saying to them.”
He added that our primary way to hear God’s voice is through ‘His word,’ the 66 books of the Bible.
“In his word though, it talks about what we call Rhema words or words where God will speak to us today. Jesus says my sheep hear my voice. I speak to them and they hear me and they know me and they follow me. So we know by the Holy Spirit, which has come to the church at Pentecost, that we have this ability now to communicate with God,” he said.
“God wants to talk to us, but it always has to line up with the character and with the will that we see in the scriptures. The scripture tells us what God’s character is like, what His will is, what His plans are, what our commission is – all of those things. So to me, when God is speaking, it can’t outright contradict the Biblical text.”
He gave a number of examples:
- God would not tell you to do something that is dishonest
- Nor would He tell you to leave your spouse so you could be with another woman (or man).
- God does want us to clean up our lives.
“He convicts us of sin, but it’s usually for redemption. God is a forgiving and loving God who will speak that love and forgiveness into us and that’s also a way in which we recognize the voice of God.”
Another test of the word is truth.
“The first step would be, does this person confirm it? Or does it happen? For example if I say, ‘God says this is going to happen in the next couple of days’ and it doesn’t happen. Then I wasn’t hearing God. There was a bunch of Christians that really believed Trump was going to be re-elected in the last election and then he wasn’t. My view would be they have to repent and realize that they did not hear God,” said Barry.
Similarly, if you say something has happened in someone’s life and they do not recognize it, it seems very likely that you did not hear from God.
Called to the Campbell River Vineyard
The Kaardals gave two examples of God speaking in their lives.
Prior to their becoming pastors of the Vineyard, 24 years ago, Barry felt like God was saying ‘I want you to pastor a church.’ When he asked his pastors about this, they suggested that the Kaardals take over leadership of the Campbell River Vineyard.
“I had a moment where I was driving in my car and I felt the Lord’s presence come into the car and then he spoke to me, ‘Barry, this is me. This open door to the ministry is me and I want you to take it. I want you to step through it,’”
“This is an interesting call though, because he didn’t say you have to step through it. He said you can, if you want, but these were the words that came into my heart, ‘if you go through, I will kill you.’ Now, what does He mean by that? It wasn’t, I’m going to kill you physically, but if you want to serve me and serve the body of Christ, it is a call to pushing other people forward and not to be the center of attention. He really spoke to me about needing to lay down my own agenda.”
The late John Paul Jackson (1950–2015) was known for the words he gave random members of congregations, when visiting churches.
“We were at a conference and John Paul Jackson picked me out of a crowd and said that God had called me to lead and pastor a church, and to actually lead young men. He specifically saw that on me, but he confirmed a call that I already had in my life,” said Barry.
Barry was a foreman at the Elk Falls Mill when he became a pastor.
“God told me that he was going to train me through the mill and management, that’s where I was going to receive a lot of my training for running a church. The church couldn’t afford to pay me. We were taking over the church when it was quite small.”
Barry continued to work in the mill for another six years, while he also pastored the Vineyard church.
Nancy added, “I felt like God told me when Barry was going to be quitting but I also believed that God said, ‘don’t tell him because I need to speak to him and I need to be the one to tell him.’
She told someone else, “This is the month and this is the year that God is calling Barry to quit.” After it occurred, the other person confirmed that was what Nancy had told her.
I don’t have cancer!
Another example of a big word in their lives occured in 2016, when Nancy had a goiter removed from her thyroid. She and Barry were called into the doctors office and were told she had a heart attack.
“No I didn’t! I feel the same now after my surgery, as I did before my surgery. What makes you think that I had a heart attack?” she replied.
They told her it was in her test results and they also showed she had cancer.
“It is not, it’s an administrative error,” said Nancy.
Barry interjected, “You know honey, you’re going to have to deal with it sometime soon and, well I’ll let you just leave that for now.”
“I believe God has said it is an administrative error and I do not have cancer,” insisted Nancy.
They were still discussing this on the way to see the specialist who did the surgery. Barry thought his wife was dying of cancer, and Nancy kept insisting, ‘I know I don’t have cancer.’
When they entered the doctor’s office, Barry said, “Okay, what’s the outcome? We already know she has cancer. So what do we have to do?”
To which the specialist responded,”what makes you think she’s got cancer?”
Barry said, “Well when we saw the doctor …”
At that point the specialist used the same words that Nancy had used, “That was an administrative error, you don’t have cancer.”
Let God speak for Himself
The Kaardals said there are times when a word is correct, but the person speaking gave an incorrect interpretation.
For example, someone might get a picture of a train running down a track. They could try to interpret the picture and say ‘We are going down the track in the wrong direction,’but that isn’t what they received.
“Where we can go wrong, is when we start to bring our own interpretation into a picture,” said Barry.
Nancy mentioned a recent prayer session where someone had seen a picture of a swan. It made no sense to her, but she described it anyway and then another lady burst into tears.
“I forget what swan’s mean to her, but it was the answer to her prayers. It’s very important to just share what you have. Don’t build on it or make it grow. Don’t put words into God’s mouth of what a picture means, or what something else means. Just let God’s Holy Spirit come and speak to whoever it is for,” she said. “It is important not to speak for God. He can do it Himself.”
Top image credit: An open Bible – Photo by Aaron Burden on Unsplash
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